Swing and a Miss

ISIL is not Islamic


Our semi-retired POTUS gave a speech last night:

Still, we continue to face a terrorist threat. We cannot erase every trace of evil from the world, and small groups of killers have the capacity to do great harm. That was the case before 9/11, and that remains true today. That’s why we must remain vigilant as threats emerge. At this moment, the greatest threats come from the Middle East and North Africa, where radical groups exploit grievances for their own gain. And one of those groups is ISIL – which calls itself the “Islamic State.”

Now let’s make two things clear: ISIL is not “Islamic.” No religion condones the killing of innocents, and the vast majority of ISIL’s victims have been Muslim. And ISIL is certainly not a state. It was formerly al Qaeda’s affiliate in Iraq, and has taken advantage of sectarian strife and Syria’s civil war to gain territory on both sides of the Iraq-Syrian border. It is recognized by no government, nor the people it subjugates. ISIL is a terrorist organization, pure and simple. And it has no vision other than the slaughter of all who stand in its way.


{{Sigh}}

I get it. I realize what he was trying to say. For valid political reasons he was attempting to draw a distinction been the Islamic State and the religion we call Islam. But what he said was like trying to distinguish Catholics from other Christian sects by saying that Catholics aren’t Christians.

The Islamic State is most certainly Islamic. They do not represent all Muslims, not even most most of them. But there is a significant portion of the world’s Muslim population that agrees with the ideology and goals of ISIS/ISIL. These people are what we call “radical Islam.”

Radical Islam is at war with the rest of the world, especially that part we call “Western Civilization.” Their ideology is incompatible with democracy, secularism, Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, you-name-itism.

They want to restore and expand the ancient Caliphate. That was a theocracy ruled by a single religious leader – a “caliph.” The original caliphs were the direct successors to Muhammad.

The Caliphate spread by armed conquest. The conquered had to convert or die. The law was called “sharia”, which is a combination of the Qur’an (the Word of Allah) and the Hadith (the words and actions of Muhammad).

Islam split into two major sects about 1400 years ago and the two groups have been at was with each other ever since. ISIS/ISIL is made up of Sunnis and they have killed thousands of Shiites in Syria and Iraq. But not all Sunnis support the Islamic State, even if they support the idea of an Islamic state.

What Obama has to deal with is the same problem that his predecessors had to deal with – some American citizens and legal residents are Muslims. So are many of our “friends and allies” in that region. Declaring war on Islam is therefore problematic.

Obama missed an opportunity that he could be uniquely qualified to seize. The Muslims of the world need to make a choice between modernity and savagery. They cannot keep one foot in both worlds. With his Muslim childhood experiences Obama can credibly claim insight into the Muslim world that most of us cannot.

This is the 21st Century, not the 7th. Muslims must accept that civil law is supreme, at least here on Earth. They must renounce terrorism and agree to live in peace with all non-Muslims. They must agree to religious freedom. They must abandon the concept of the Caliphate.

They must stop supporting radical Islam. They must take the lead in eradicating it.

It is not fair to our military to expect them to tell the “good” Muslims from the “bad” ones. Otherwise, when in doubt our troops will have to kill them all and let Allah sort them out.

One last thing: We will not destroy the Islamic State with surgical airstrikes and untrustworthy allies. Sooner or later we will need “boots on the ground.”

Apparently it will be later.


Obama announces a new "bunker" strategy.

Obama announces a new “bunker” strategy.


About Myiq2xu

I was born and raised in a different country - America. I don't know what this place is.
This entry was posted in Barack Obama, ISIS/Islamic State/The Caliphate, Islam, Worst President Ever! and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

138 Responses to Swing and a Miss

  1. The Klown says:

    Roger L. Simon:

    Pity Barack Obama. Our hapless chief executive must be suffering from a cognitive disorder the size of Alpha Centauri. The poor guy grew up on the anti-imperialist mouthings of lefty poet Frank Marshall Davis, schoolboy revolutionary Bill Ayers and later anti-Israel professor Rashid Khalidi, not to mention the well-known anti-American excrescences of the Reverend Jeremiah Wright, and now he has to go to war — as an imperialist — against the very Third World people he was told again and again we colonized and destroyed. His head must be about to explode.

    No wonder he insisted in his Wednesday night speech that the Islamic State is not Islamic — what is it? Hindu? Zoroastrian? A lost tribe of Hasidic Jews? — and that we are fighting an amorphous “terrorist group” (the Irish Republican Army? Basque separatists perhaps?), not the jihadism whose violent ideology has so obviously metastasized across several continents under many guises during his administration with no end remotely in sight. He dares not name our enemy, although it’s almost impossible to imagine how we could win without doing so. He cannot say anything that’s true because he doesn’t know what is true or, perhaps more likely, is terrified to know and then have to admit it. If he did, everything would unravel, not just the jejune Marxism of Frank Marshall Davis. Everything.

    But he does know what his poll numbers are and they aren’t good. So we are where we are. Half way in and half way out. Forget Winston Churchill. Forget Douglas MacArthur. The USA is going to war with a nowhere man who no longer knows what he stands for — and who originally stood for very little more than widely discredited and tired left-wing drivel masquerading as hope and change. Now even that’s gone, a distant memory.

  2. Lulu says:

    Last night the president gave a speech about something he doesn’t understand written by people who are historical and cultural illiterates to a people who are getting a clue that he doesn’t know what the hell he is doing or know what he is talking about. While many presidents faced steep learning curves in office, had firm and committed ideologies, and were tested with danger and swiftly changing circumstances, this one is regressing. He cannot keep up. His little and narrow world view is blowing up and he cannot adapt nor adjust. “Leading from behind” and governing by poll are flattering descriptions of an average, rigid, lazy intellect who projects his own faults on the people he is supposed to be governing. Dawdling, procrastinating, and rebelliously goofing is a reaction to the world leaving him in the dust. He is in full CYA mode and he will never get out of it.

    • The Klown says:

      If he had any hope of salvaging his legacy he would have to become a born-again hard foreign policy hawk and go after ISIS like a honey badger.

      That would alienate his base and his Arab friends, but his poll ratings would shoot up.

      • Lulu says:

        That would require someone who is smart having a “lightbulb” moment. This is not a deep thinker here. He tried to bullshit his way out of ignoring ISIS while maintaining his cognitive dissonance. The “religion of peace” is run by a barbarous death cult. Everyone can see this but the crazy. It did not work because none of his baloney cuts it anymore. The same with the immigration can being kicked down the road because he is going to “think” about it and “get it right”. That is his code for dropping it and “don’t bug me anymore”. His staff (all four of them who are allowed into his regal presence) will try to “pivot” to some stupid shit. Expect another drop in the polls that will freak out Democrats. The Dems have to get rid of him. He is not salvageable. I had hoped that the crooks in the Dem Party would have enough survival instinct left and then I hear Hairy Reed orally hallucinating and I’m not so sure.

        • WMCB says:

          They won’t get rid of him. They can’t. He is the First Black President. Keeping him and polishing that turd may be futile, but to jettison him is suicide. Progs won’t commit suicide.

      • Constance says:

        All official history will ever say about Obama and his policy is that he is the black President and because everyone is racist his brilliant policy was dismantled and opposed by racist power brokers.

    • 49erDweet says:

      OK, Lulu. Enough with the good news. Now what’s the bad?

      • Lulu says:

        My mother in law has been moved to assisted living! She leaves behind a 4,000 square foot house full of junk and exquisitely ugly 1950’s fake French furniture. There is also a grand piano that no one wants. I also noticed that one of the chimneys is separating from the house. I haven’t told anyone about that yet for fear of fainting at the cost to repair. I expect to find bats on the half second floor. There is a 1890’s cowboy saddle (her father’s) sitting on a stand at the stair landing. Just your average house! Guess who gets to clean this sucker out?

        • The Klown says:

          Contact someone who does estate sales.

        • 49erDweet says:

          {{Shudder}} Except for the separating chimney, we’ve survived one of those. Took eight three day weekends in a row, plus 1 loooong day travel each way. Will not do it again!!!! Made about a jillion trips to the dump. Sold everything else. Made about 20k on ‘stuff’ but it was my sisters, not ours. We are trying to decide if we should do that to our kids or just burn it all down when we go. I’m voting for the revenge factor, but my honey is a softie.

        • Constance says:

          She’s not dead yet. See what she wants to give away to relatives, all you can do with the rest is put it in storage, when the day comes that you inherit it you can abandon the storage locker or have an estate sale. You would be surprised what people will buy at an estate sale. Also I am a sentimental person and I took 6 large trailer loads to the dump from my parents place. Some stuff is clearly junk, even to a sentimental person like me.

          • Lulu says:

            She sure isn’t dead yet. And she wants the house sold and final say on who buys it. I suggested a UHaul day for relatives to take whatever they want. I told her it could be a party. We could have it catered. She liked that. She can make a grand entrance in an ambulance. My husband has even gotten a few tentative calls to buy it. No one knows what it is worth. It is on the bay in Corpus Christi so it is a house with quite a view even it it is full of junk and ugly stuff and semi falling down.

  3. The Klown says:
  4. The Klown says:
    • The Klown says:

      Uh-oh! Half a dozen racist rednecks living out in the boonies are gonna start a second Civil War!

      • votermom says:

      • DeniseVB says:

        I took the clickbait, I must shower now.

        • Somebody says:

          I didn’t take the click bait……what’s the bottom line……is it southern white racists? I’m so sick of that meme. Those assholes from Salon should actually come down here and see the south……we actually (gasp) mix with various races on a daily basis. The south is very integrated, but still we hear how racist we are……yawn.

          • The Klown says:

            They mention some group but tellingly they never say how big it is.

            There will always be haters and nutcases out there. The fact that they exist doesn’t mean anyone will follow them.

          • DeniseVB says:

            Yeah something like that. Racists with former ties to the Klan and neo-nazi’s are whipping up some new group of haters.

            I love living in the south and just far enough north to enjoy the four seasons. Love to joke about my being born in a hospital that was used by the North in the Civil War and 17 years later graduated from a high school named after Robert E. Lee, so I am of mixed allegiance to the Civil War discussions 😀

          • Constance says:

            “The south is very integrated, but still we hear how racist we are”
            That is because the elitists and also people of color don’t recognize that there are different classes of white people. Most white people had nothing to do with slavery and we are treated just as poorly by the elitists as people of color.

        • elliesmom says:

          The most segregated place I’ve ever lived was Chicago.

  5. The Klown says:
    • Lulu says:

      Jim Beam can offer Uncle Joe a lifetime supply if HE will step down simultaneously.

    • leslie says:

      Frankly, Biden looks better than bronco. At least at this point. We’d at the very least know where he stands on things. He’s made it known repeatedly. And it’s too late to take it all back. (even though bronco has made a career at refuting what he has said/done).

      • DeniseVB says:

        I think as early as 2006, I supported Biden for President. After watching Cspan coverage of him addressing (campaigning?) an LGBT group where only about 4 people showed up. He left the podium to go sit with them among all the empty chairs, Cspan cameras kept rolling for as long as Joe kept talking to them for about an hour or so. I saw content of character that day. So no, he can’t be worse than Obama 😀

        • 49erDweet says:

          I’ve long thought Biden had great political skills. He knows how to appeal to his base and get elected. Where he falls shirt, IMO, is in knowing what to do afterwards. IF he had the right staff, he might have a chance……..but going in with bronco’s idiots already firmly ensconced we’d all be dead meat within a month or so.

  6. votermom says:

    In other news, the Pope is not Catholic.

  7. Kathy says:

    Roger Simon has an interesting take on this..makes sense. Again, he looks sick and vacant to me– vacant eyes.

    • 49erDweet says:

      Or did TOTUS move itself? Is it possible we’ve had a techie coup and not recognized it? Could the teleprompter now be running the country? Did that crooked flag pin look like a treefruit with a bite missing?

  8. Lulu says:

    The entire fighting “ISIL” is a hatched up complicated ruse to get past the next election. None of it will work. Too many moving parts, false assumptions with wishful thinking, ignorance, and desperation are driving it all. It is not meant to be implemented. It is simply a means to scrape by the next election the same as the immigration executive order postponement when the WH and Democrats realized events were running them over. He didn’t have a plan last week and this week this is what was hashed out with dibs and dabs from State, the Pentagon, ValJar, the UN, and a think tank or two. The Brits usually have a few highfaluting doublespeak throwaways to add but they are kind of busy trying not to loose a third of their contiguous territory at present. Bronco is desperately trying to hang on until November.

    • The Klown says:

      When the Pentagon offered up “Mutual Assured Destruction” (MAD) as a nuclear war strategy, Defense Sec’ty Robert S. McNamara supposedly said “This isn’t a plan, it’s some kind of horrible spasm.”

      • Lulu says:

        Yep. A spasm induced by election polling. A panic spasm that had a last chance. This is the result of not reading your daily briefs which are a prezzie’s daily homework. It is the result of not talking to Congress but going to your cook’s wedding. It is the cascading failure of thinking you are smarter than everyone else and all you know is Chicago pay to play and race baiting. I think an institutional revolt may be underway. He has no support from anyone with an ounce of sense. He and his band of idiots are getting people killed.

        • WMCB says:

          I’d love to be a fly on the wall inside the Pentagon and CIA etc right now. Those long-time military and civil servants who last through administrations must be trying like hell to contain the damage this fool is doing.

  9. votermom says:

    This is great

  10. DeniseVB says:

    Sigh.

    • Lulu says:

      Notice he is talking to a failed novelist. TWO fabulists with ZERO experience in geopolitics or anything else. The acclaimed creator of the Benghazi lies is advising the prezzie on how to bullshit his way around ISIS.

      • SHV says:

        Ben is Obama’s, only foreign policy adviser. Author of the “Cairo” speech, promoter of Arab Spring, originator of Benghazi coverup, etc., etc.. I think that he is one of the very few people who has access to the President.

      • DeniseVB says:

        I just noticed something …. the WH and Trump’s golf offer tweets were timestamped at the exact same time. WH-a little over 1k retweets, Trump-well over 13k retweets. At this time. Verrrrrry interesting.

  11. The Klown says:

    IT WAS 13 YEARS AGO TODAY: Alan Jackson – “Where Were You (When The World Stopped Turning)”:

  12. The Klown says:

    Courtesy Of The Red, White And Blue (The Angry American):

  13. The Klown says:

    George W. Bush – 9/11 Bullhorn Speech:

    • The Klown says:

      I never voted for George Bush, but when the towers fell I was glad he was our president because I knew he would stomp the cockroaches that did it.

      • WMCB says:

        Honk! Me too. I still think going into Iraq was a bone-headed move. But at least he had a strategy (albeit flawed), and a clear idea of the difference between us and them.

  14. The Klown says:

    McCain: Facts are stubborn things Mr. Carney:

    • jeffhas says:

      I’m beginning to like the idea of Carney at CNN. If all guests challenge him (like McCain did) with his own words, that could get real fun, real fast.

      Lying spokesdevil whose words come back to haunt him… In my wildest dreams.

  15. Somebody says:

    I’m glad I missed his speech last night. I was going to watch, but my daughter called just before 9pm. Clearly it was for the best I probably would have thrown something at my TV and since I just replaced all of them over the past year it’s best that I refrained from watching.

    I am glad to see that even the most loyal bots are questioning this. Islamic State isn’t Islam, what a crock of shit. I get what you’re saying Klown, about ISIS not representing all muslims, but if the moderate muslims don’t support ISIS then they better stand the fuck up now. The lack of massive outrage in the muslim community speaks volumes. I’m certainly no scholar of the Qur’an, Koran, however you spell it……..but my limited understanding is it pretty much says the infidels must convert or be killed. It is my understanding there is a middle ground where the infidel can be basically a slave. I’m not cool with any of that and I don’t think most of the citizens of the world are either. I don’t have a problem with people worshipping the great spaghetti monster. Unless they believe the great spaghetti monster is telling them to kill or enslave anyone that doesn’t believe in the great spaghetti monster…….then we have a problem, it’s not a religion it’s a death cult.

    Also, it is my understanding that ISIS has in fact killed large numbers of Sunni as well. Apparently if a Sunni isn’t fundamental enough for them, or if a Sunni helps an infidel they’re fair game to ISIS.

    • Lulu says:

      There are no “moderate” Muslims. That does not mean that the majority of them would do the atrocities that fundamentalists are so good at. It means that it is part of their theology and they are believers. It is the same thing in the UK with the child rape/prostitution gangs. Most of the Muslim residents would never do such a thing but they will not criticize, turn in, or stop the ones doing it because the Koran says it is perfectly ok to do it. The same goes for the idiots going over to serve ISIS. The general run of the mill Muslim believes it is acceptable because the Koran says so. I’m sure many privately have their doubts. The progs, libs, etc saying “I know nice Muslims who would never do such a thing.” Big whoop. They don’t know what the fuck they are doing in private such as supporting extremist mosques, contributing to the ones going over to ISIS, withholding information from the police on child rapes, etc. This is their religious and cultural teaching and includes death and slavery of non-Muslims . People cannot get this through their heads. Non-violent Muslims have it both ways. That has to end.

      • The Klown says:

        Moderate Muslim = A jihadi who is out of ammo

      • Erica says:

        Lulu, what you said here really reminds me of Obama himself. He never can accept that the people who are committing atrocities are Muslims. Not on the personal level (honor killings); squad terror (9/11); or larger scope war acts (I would include ISIS, Benghazi, etc). He’s just can’t go there. I think he is truly Muslim in his heart, which would be fine, but he cannot act effectively as president because he makes false distinctions to protect his world view. It may not be conscious (giving benefit of doubt) but I don’t think it is accidental that the push for Sharia/Islamic ascendancy is so strong around the world with him as president.

  16. votermom says:

  17. HELENK3 says:

    http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/65921

    King Putt’s Islamic state of Denial

    • Lulu says:

      It was made by a committee of WH favorites and insiders to spin it before the election. Bronco will do exactly squat before the election with infinite reasons why it hasn’t been done. “It takes a while to be up and running” or “we are reviewing all of our options so we get it right”. The usual procrastination and delaying tactics will be used except for arming the Syrian “moderates” who are Assad’s enemies. After the election he will have no reason to have to pretend any longer.

  18. votermom says:

    I am always in awe of the regular folks on United 93. True heroes.

    • The Klown says:

      If you gotta die, do it fighting back and see how many bad guys you can take with you.

      • Lulu says:

        There was a famous fight at the local courthouse in the late 1800’s after a court case (land dispute). The looser shot the winner and people grabbed the shooter. But then the wounded winner shot the looser back and said “You’re coming with me you son of a bitch.” Then they both died. I have read the newspaper account of it. There were lots of witnesses. You would think they could have waited until they were away from the courthouse.

  19. votermom says:

    Ari Fleischer is tweeting the day as he remembers it. Love this.

    Also I had forgotten that Rumsfield refused to evacuate on 9/11. Stubborn old git.

    I miss having leaders with stones.

    • elliesmom says:

      My BFF invited my husband and me to a private showing of the Dick Cheney documentary. My husband had worked for Cheney when he was CEO of G.D.Searle and wasn’t very happy about some of the things Cheney did there. She was very upset when Elliesdad left the theater saying he had new respect for the guy. That wasn’t supposed to happen. He was supposed to go to the after party and rant. Most of the people were surprised to find the guy was actually somewhat likeable.

      • WMCB says:

        There are very few people in the world who are utterly good or utterly evil. Cheney and Bush were wrong about so much, because their underlying assumptions were wrong about so much. It doesn’t make them evil – it makes them wrong. Some of their ideology was, IMO, evil, because following it will have evil results. No different than sincere communists: I’ve known some who were good people, who wanted to make the world a better place. Their sincerity does not make their ideology not-evil. But they themselves may or may not be.

        I’ve known decent neo-cons and asshole ones. I’ve know decent communists and asshole ones. People need to grow up. Truths and facts and ideas can be black and white, right/wrong. But human beings rarely are.

  20. votermom says:

    Sorry about the typo

  21. votermom says:

  22. votermom says:

  23. The Klown says:

    Obama should have made that speech before a joint session of Congress, and he should have asked for a declaration of war against the Islamic State.

    • leslie says:

      That would be like asking permission from your mother to stay out past curfew. He’s not gonna accept that Congress is bigger than the presidency. And he’s certainly not gonna ask permission from Republicans for anything.

  24. HELENK3 says:

    http://freebeacon.com/national-security/turkey-denies-u-s-permission-for-combat-attacks-on-isil/

    Turkey denies US permission for combat attacks on isis.
    so now what?

  25. The Klown says:
  26. The Klown says:

    Sen. Cruz booed at In Defense of Christians Dinner:

  27. SHV says:

    LuLu is on fire today!!! :>)

  28. WMCB says:

    The problem with Islam is that there is no such thing as “My kingdom is not of this world” in Islam. IT IS AND ALWAYS WAS AN EARTHLY POLITICAL MOVEMENT. The Church may have had her Crusades, but they were an aberration, not the founding concept from the beginning. Our prophet and savior died, voluntarily, and told us to do the same. Put away your fecking sword, Peter – my kingdom is not won that way. That coin Christ commented upon with “whose image is this?” drew a clear distinction between “that which is Caesars’s” and “that which is God’s.” There was no command to go BE Caesar.

    Islam was BORN of the sword. Its primary prophet was a world-conquering general. Its primary charge to its adherents is not “be personally holy so as to be fit for the afterlife”, it is “MAKE THE WORLD SUBMIT TO ALLAH.” Go be Caesar. Some wish to do that via horrible violence, and some prefer to do it via infiltrating laws and politics – but the idea of religion being in any way permanently separable from the state is a minority opinion in Islam (there are a few, but not many)

    Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Pagans, etc are not charged by their prophets and wise men to rule this earthly world. Muslims are. Christians preach a God who is concerned with the heart, therefore forced conversion is worthless to their God – it must by definition be voluntary to be real. Muslims preach a God who desires outward submission, so via the sword or the law doesn’t matter in that context. If they are not ruling the world, then they have spiritually failed, in their context.

    Most religions have some problematic passages/historical leaders that they have had to “reinterpret” to take a peaceful path. Over the centuries, they have sorted through and decided that burning folks alive in a wicker man, or trials by torture, or too much involvement with the secular, etc were a misunderstanding of their faith. But Islam? Islam would have to almost deny their entire body of history and teaching to make that leap. Because its not a few aberrations or extreme interpretations as it is with most other religions. It’s their entire faith, from the beginning. I admire the few who have sincerely tried to do that – to relegate world domination to a spiritual, not temporal, interpretation. But it’s much harder to do with Islam than any other faith, because it was explicitly temporal and “rule THIS world” from the get go.

    And that’s the problem. The classically liberal West can deal with and incorporate all manner of religions. It cannot incorporate something that is as much a totalitarian earthly political ideology as a religion – even where it favors “non-violent” means.

    The divide in Islam is mostly between those who wish to establish world domination violently, and those who prefer to do it non-violently, by using the west’s own institutions against us. Very few Muslims, from my observation, are outside either of those two paradigms. The ones who are, are fighting an uphill battle not just to rein in their faith, but to completely redefine it.

  29. WMCB says:

    Obama’s speech in a nutshell:

    “Imma just randomly do what Bush didn’t.” (Except where I try a few things that he did that seemed to be kinda popular.)

    Alinskyites are incapable of strategy, because their ideology only requires them to have an evil domestic foil to contrast themselves with. There is no there there. It’s all playing off of “The Other”. They have no identity or ideas of their own.

    • Lulu says:

      That is why calling them selves the creative class was just projection.

    • The Klown says:

      Revolution is a lot easier than governing.

      • WMCB says:

        Their ignorance of history is just astounding. These idiots are going to lead us into a new Dark Ages, because they have NO CLUE as to what, exactly, the underpinnings of a pluralistic Western civilization are. The roots go far back – to Aristotle, and Plato, and even Aquinas. Western civilization did not begin at the Enlightenment.

        They want to keep the pretty building while industriously undermining the foundations. And they will be the first to cry and wail “WHAT HAPPENED??” when the whole fucking edifice falls.

  30. votermom says:

    Hah Ha!!! *points & laughs*

  31. SHV says:

    “The Church may have had her Crusades, but they were an aberration, not the founding concept from the beginning.”
    *****
    Perhaps the biggest problem with the Crusades was the poor implementation. The Middle East, North Africa, Anatolia, etc. were Roman then Christian for a thousand years before conquest by Islam. The Eastern Roman Empire held out until the fall of Byzantium/Constantinople in 1453. I think what we are seeing with ISIS and other Islamic groups is a very, very small picture of what Europe was seeing with the advancing Muslim Armies. The Muslim armies nearly over ran Western Europe and linked up with the Muslim armies in Iberia until they were defeated at Tours. The idea that the Crusades were somehow an evil Christian assault on peaceful Muslim countries is pure BS.

    • Somebody says:

      They were in a kill or be killed position. Their survival instincts kicked in. I wonder whether some of the western civilizations still have survival instincts, or more appropriately do any of their leaders?

    • WMCB says:

      Agreed. The Crusades did not happen in a vacuum. They were a response to Muslim conquest that was rapidly spreading. The idea that the Christian nations just went and attacked an utterly peaceful people who were minding their own business is a flat lie. Whatever “atrocities” they committed (and those were pretty much ordinary standard warfare for ALL nations of the time), they were responding to another bloody triumphalist religious state openly bent on world domination.

      I’m also sick of hearing how much “Islam” has contributed to civilization. Bullshit. Most of what they claim to have “contributed” is leftover Persian ideas from the ZoroAstrians. The Arabs and Persians have indeed contributed – but most of their contributions pre-dated and were in SPITE of Islam, not because of it.

      Islam has pretty much taken every nation it has conquered into the stone age. There is no flowering of art, science, architecture, commerce, etc. The few Islamic states that have managed not to be stone age have done so by somewhat preserving/building on the earlier contributions of the West or the Byzantines or the Persians. Also by preserving the best for a privileged few, while the people live in squalor.

      Which, BTW, is how progs operate as well. They grab all the benefits of earlier classical civilization that has formed and allowed them to even exist, but are utterly ignorant and scornful off the underpinnings of that learning and prosperity, and so eventually destroy it.

      You know who built Western (and much of Eastern European) civilization as we know it? The Hellenist Greeks and the Romans, later expanded and piggy-backed upon by Christendom. In the far East, it was built by the dynasties and Confucianism and Buddhism. Islam hasn’t built shit. Half of their most beautiful mosques, etc were Christian architecture that they conquered and parasited upon and converted to their own use. In the ME, it was either Byzantine Christian or classic Persian civilization that they cannibalized.

      Islam has “built” and “contributed” Jack Shit.

      • WMCB says:

        BTW, I’m in the midst of reading Norwich’s three-volume history of Byzantium. Fascinating. I hope to finish it in this lifetime, but it’s humongous.

        • SHV says:

          Thanks for the reference. I read the first volume years ago. Unfortunately not available in audio format; three volumes would be perfect for long road trips and yard work.

          • WMCB says:

            There is a one-volume condensed version also, which may be available on audio, but I’m trying to plow my way through the real deal.

  32. gram cracker says:

    How we got here. Hot Air article with several links that provide detailed insight into how the principle driver of Obama’s foreign policy was/is based on the politics of his getting reelected in 2012 and not losing the Senate in 2014.

    And what about SOS Clinton? Did she push for a Status of Forces agreement with Maliki? If she disagreed with President Obama’s foreign policy actions and wasn’t able to effectively influence him to act on policies she believed in, she should have resigned. We don’t need another President who places politics above country.

    “Tim Arango, Baghdad Bureau Chief for the New York Times, ask me anything.
    How do you rate the Obama administrations actions in Iraq? What did they do right? What did they get wrong?
    it’s not my job to rate the obama administrations actions in iraq. but i will tell you that after 2011 the administration basically ignored the country. and when officials spoke about what was happening there they were often ignorant of the reality. they did not want to see what was really happening because it conflicted with their narrative that they left iraq in reasonably good shape. In 2012 as violence was escalating i wrote a story, citing UN statistics, that showed how civilian deaths from attacks were rising. Tony Blinken, who was then Biden’s national security guy and a top iraq official, pushed back, even wrote a letter to the editor, saying that violence was near historic lows. that was not true. even after falluja fell to ISIS at the end of last year, the administration would push back on stories about maliki’s sectarian tendencies, saying they didn’t see it that way. so there was a concerted effort by the administration to not acknowledge the obvious until it became so apparent — with the fall of mosul — that iraq was collapsing.”

    http://hotair.com/archives/2014/09/10/nyt-baghdad-bureau-chief-the-white-house-lied-to-americans-for-years-about-what-bad-shape-iraq-was-in/

    The linked articles are lengthy and can make your head spin trying to keep all the players straight in your head, but expose how SUSFU our foreign policy has been and will continue to be under “that one” and his ilk.

  33. gram cracker says:

    Fascinating and frightening behind the scenes view of the real puppet master of the Middle East.

    The Shadow Commander
    Qassem Suleimani is the Iranian operative who has been reshaping the Middle East. Now he’s directing Assad’s war in Syria.

    http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/09/30/the-shadow-commander?currentPage=all

  34. gram cracker says:

    What We Left Behind
    An increasingly authoritarian leader, a return of sectarian violence, and a nation worried for its future.

    Ben Rhodes, the U.S. deputy national-security adviser, told me that Obama believes a full withdrawal was the right decision. “There is a risk of overstating the difference that American troops could make in the internal politics of Iraq,” he said. “Having troops there did not allow us to dictate sectarian alliances. Iraqis are going to respond to their own political imperatives.” But U.S. diplomats and commanders argue that they played a crucial role, acting as interlocutors among the factions—and curtailing Maliki’s sectarian tendencies.

    “We used to restrain Maliki all the time,” Lieutenant General Michael Barbero, the deputy commander in Iraq until January, 2011, told me. “If Maliki was getting ready to send tanks to confront the Kurds, we would tell him and his officials, ‘We will physically block you from moving if you try to do that.’ ” Barbero was angry at the White House for not pushing harder for an agreement. “You just had this policy vacuum and this apathy,” he said. “Now we have no leverage in Iraq. Without any troops there, we’re just another group of guys.” There is no longer anyone who can serve as a referee, he said, adding, “Everything that has happened there was not just predictable—we predicted it.”

    http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/04/28/what-we-left-behind

  35. The Klown says:
  36. The Klown says:
  37. The Klown says:
  38. WMCB says:

    In truth, all modern ME involvement historically is, to at least some extent, “War for Oil.” No, not in the sense that the idiot pacifists insist – that we go and STEAL TEH OILZ!! Silliness.No, we haven’t done that, in Iraq or anywhere else. But in the sense that a stable ME is needed to keep the energy flowing to the rest of us, yes. That’s the strategic interest, and it’s a huge one.

    My question to the “No war for oil” morons is this: “What is your alternative?” Because we can’t do without the oil. No developed nation can at present. That’s reality. Do you have anything other than a slogan? Because slogans won’t keep the delivery trucks running or the power on. We live in a world dependent on oil, for the forseeable future. In the case of the USA, we also live in a world utterly dependent on the dollar being the exchange medium for oil. If that ends, we end. Chanting “NO WAR FOR OIL!” isn’t going to change that cold hard fact. Grow the fuck up. If you have an argument make it – so long as it doesn’t consist of unicorns and rainbows and a world that does not exist except in your idyllic imagination.

  39. gram cracker says:

    Obama’s Disastrous Iraq Policy: An Autopsy
    The president ignored the country and its increasingly dictatorial prime minister for years.

    Under an agreement signed by George W. Bush, the U.S. was to withdraw forces from Iraq by the end of 2011. American military officials, fearful that Iraq might unravel without U.S. supervision, wanted to keep 20,000 to 25,000 troops in the country after that. Obama now claims that maintaining any residual force was impossible because Iraq’s parliament would not give U.S. soldiers immunity from prosecution. Given how unpopular America’s military presence was among ordinary Iraqis, that may well be true. But we can’t fully know because Obama—eager to tout a full withdrawal from Iraq in his reelection campaign—didn’t push hard to keep troops in the country. As a former senior White House official told Peter Baker of The New York Times, “We really didn’t want to be there and [Maliki] really didn’t want us there.… [Y]ou had a president who was going to be running for re-election, and getting out of Iraq was going to be a big statement.”

    http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/06/obamas-disastrous-iraq-policy-an-autopsy/373225/?single_page=true

  40. SHV says:

    “Dem Sen. Denounces ISIS ‘Fear-Mongering’: Same as ‘After 9/11′”
    ““It’s fear-mongering,” Harkin said. “It’s what happened after 9/11. ‘Oh my god, they’ve got these planes crashing. Now they’re going to take over America.’ That’s nonsense.”

    “We overreacted to 9/11,” he continued. “Most of the people that did 9/11 were Saudis. Why the hell didn’t we invade Saudi Arabia? There wasn’t one Iraqi involved in 9/11. We just keep jumping from one mistake to another. I have a feeling we’re going to do the same thing with [ISIS].”

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/dem-sen-denounces-isis-fear-mongering-same-as-after-911/

    He is basically correct. Under Bush/Cheney and Obama, “protect and defend the Constitution” has become a quaint phrase of historical interest. “Terrists” and Islamists, in the big picture are an irritant that should be dealt with, without imposition of a police state. The existential threat to this country is economic. The economy is a hollow shell of its former self and social stability is only maintained by pumping a trillion dollars a year into Wall Street and another trillion into means tested public assistance. When the US credit runs out, that will be the real test of US survival.

    • WMCB says:

      The biggest threat to the USA is not ISIS terrorists (though they could do damage.) It’s the failure to recognize the existential threat that the Islamist ideology poses if we fail to call it what it is.

      Rotherham didn’t happen because of “terrorists.” It happened because the REAL danger (ideology incompatible with Western Civilization) got coddled.

  41. mcnorman says:

    Whatever happened to “they bring a knife, you bring a gun” master of the universe?

  42. SHV says:

    “the Islamist ideology poses if we fail to call it what it is. ”
    *****
    That might change with an election. Both political parties, C of C, big industry, etc., pushing policies that will continue to degrade US wages and income will not change with elections. IMO, a society changing economic downturn is much more likely threat than religious/political ideology. Over the next 500-1000 years, however, world wide Islam may be the future, who knows.

  43. The Klown says:
  44. WMCB says:

    No one reads any history anymore. Or if they do, they read it to find ammunition for moralizing a pre-set view, NOT for its real value: the fact that geopolitics and human nature have changed very little in hundreds of years. Oh, the players and the issues change, but human beings and what drives them (and nations) does not.

    Progress is not magical. Human beings today are not “better people” than our ancestors – we just have more tech and different forms of govt. There is no “right side of history”. History is not a force of its own, with mystical powers that drive us ever onward to better things. History is whatever the victors make it. It’s all human beings, in the end. There is no Magic Progress Fairy.

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